I do believe that God is Jesus and that Jesus is God. How do I explain this? It just doesn't make sense to me. That's what I've heard. How is Jesus both?
Responses (10)
The trinity is a pagan concept that existed long before Jesus came along. There are many books titled "Babylon Mystery Religion" detailing the history. The BMR grew mainly by absorbing smaller pagan churches, and when Christianity became the official religion of Rome, the BMR absorbed that too.
Jesus is not God.
John 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; 6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
Jesus didn't know the divine mystery. If Jesus had been God, John 4:22 would have been a lie, and God can not lie.
John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
The trinity doctrine contradicts those verses. That is why churches that teach the trinity discourage studying the bible, declaring that church tradition is of higher authority than the word of God.
I'ma take a wild guess that person is of the LDS.
Besides the many other verses, I'm going to sum it up with one verse, my favorite verse...
Isaiah 9:6 - For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; .And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace
I will add, that when I pray, it is to God/Father in heaven and I end it in Jesus' name.
On my 2nd comment regarding "Jewels Vern", I messed up and said LDS when I should have said Jevhovas Witness.
so what are you suggesting?
I'm just saying Jehovah Witnesses don't believe Jesus is God. I don't know much about LDS (Mormons) and their view on Jesus. I will say that both denominations are trained VERY well and they stand ready for a debate.
I'm just saying Jehovah Witnesses don't believe Jesus is God. I don't know much about LDS (Mormons) and their view on Jesus. I will say that both denominations are trained VERY well and they stand ready for a debate.
So are you saying that YOU don't believe they're the same divine entity
If you look at my 1st comment, I believe God provides himself in 3 forms, but all being 1. So, I view Jesus as God in the flesh.
My understanding is God is the creator of all things even the angels . That even what we call satin the devil was one of God's creations. Then God wanting a son of human form and chose the virgin Mary to give birth to his holy son Jesus. Which until the right time and age was raised as normal child. Then God his father came to him spoke to him. And Jesus did God's will on earth to try teach and guide people in the right direction of God's will for man kind on earth. So Jesus is the son of God the creator of all things on earth. That God love us so much that he gave us his only human born son for our sins. Jesus was sacrifice for our sins. . Your religion will need to belief Jesus is the son of God. That God the father of Jesus spoke to him while Jesus was on earth. . And Jesus is now by God's side as the holy spirit of Jesus the son of god.. Being of close likeness of God Jesus is our savior . Thru Jesus as our savior we all able to join God in heaven and our loved ones in heaven.
The only way to explain that God is Jesus. Is that God himself made himself be born from the virgin Mary. That put himself inside the virgin Mary wound to be born. . I myself never read or was taught that. . So to try to confess others that Jesus and God is the same God. You would have to belief God the creator of all things was born from the virgin Mary. You need to belief God put another angel to oversee us while he was developing inside the virgin Mary and growing up for 33 yrs and until his death. Or that during the time on earth as Jesus he only watch over just a few people . How could the God of our understanding be Jesus and God. Are there more than one God. . Some may say since Jesus is the son of God that make Jesus a God also. . But my understanding is Jesus is our Lord and savior. God is our heavenly father our creator of all things.
The only way to explain that God is Jesus. Is that God himself made himself be born from the virgin Mary. That put himself inside the virgin Mary wound to be born. . I myself never read or was taught that. . So to try to confess others that Jesus and God is the same God. You would have to belief God the creator of all things was born from the virgin Mary. You need to belief God put another angel to oversee us while he was developing inside the virgin Mary and growing up for 33 yrs and until his death. Or that during the time on earth as Jesus he only watch over just a few people . How could the God of our understanding be Jesus and God. Are there more than one God. . Some may say since Jesus is the son of God that make Jesus a God also. . But my understanding is Jesus is our Lord and savior. God is our heavenly father our creator of all things.
God seems to be everything sometimes. God is love, he is Jesus, he is the Holy Spirit, he is everything, but how. I know that Jesus is God, I know that because God told me and so did the bible, but how? It seems that while Jesus was on the cross, he had a different attitude to the situation and prayed to God...to himself?
Jesus explains it very clearly at John 14:28 You heard that I said to you, I am going away and I am coming back to you. If you love me, you would rejoice that I am going my way to the Father, because the Father is greater than I am.
John 5:19 Therefore, in answer, Jesus went on to say to them: " Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he beholds the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these the Son also does in like manner. As extraordinary as Jesus role is, he makes it clear that he is subordinate to God. John 5:30: I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative, just as I hear, I judge; and the judgement I render is righteous, because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him that sent me.
I don't seem to be getting many straight forward answers-can you clarify please?
The relation between God and Jesus is very similar to the relation between a human father and his son. The human father existed before his son just as God existed before his son, Jesus. Sometimes people will say, "That boy is just like his father". They say that because sometimes a human son will have the same qualities and personality as his father. Many people believe that God is the Father and the Son. However, Jesus never claimed to be equal to his Father. He often said, "The Father is greater than I am" (read John 14:28). Jesus could say this because unlike him, his Father had a beginning.
The boy is LIKE his father, not his father-they are not one...
The god in the Qur'an, is described as being "the father of lies". The devil in the bible is described as: And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. (Revelation 12:9
Islam....i pray God will be with us and help us to discern. May God be with you.
Is described by whom? You didn't reference your quote, nor did you actually answer the point I made. I was just putting up the Islamic perspective, take it or leave it, then be happy...
Jesus gives us the answer at John 20:17 when he tells Mary Magdalene to: "Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the FATHER. But go to my brothers and say to them, 'I am ascending to my FATHER and your FATHER and to my GOD and your GOD "
In this scripture, Jesus mentions the relationship that he has with God, which is a Father and son relationship. In that verse Jesus never mentioned that he is equal to his heavenly Father, Jehovah.
jw.org
Let’s let God’s word the Bible answer the question, Is Jesus and God one person?
John 17:3 tells us, ‘This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.’ Please keep in mind God himself is saying if we want everlasting life we must take in knowledge of both him and his Son Jesus Christ. This clearly shows that God was speaking about two different individuals.
John 3:6 tells us, ‘For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.’ Again God is speaking about two different individuals. He send his son to die for us . God did not say he is coming to die for us. But said he is sending his son. Again acknowledging that He and his sons are two different individuals.
Matthew 3:16,17 tells us: After being baptized, Jesus immediately came up from the water; and look! the heavens were opened up, and he saw God’s spirit descending like a dove and coming upon him. Look! Also, a voice from the heavens said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved. “ Here Jesus was on the earth being baptized, if Jesus and God is one, who was speaking from the heavens saying this is my Son whom I have approved? It does not make sense because all the scriptural scriptural verses surely makes it clear that Jesus and God are two different individuals.
It’s like a man who has a Son, can we say he and his father are the same person? Definitely no. So if God who created us individually will he not create his son individual to him also.
A good way to understand this is to ponder upon the Trinity, the father, the son, and the Holy Spirit. Here we understand that the father in heaven is the Divine God, the son is Jesus, he came to earth, he manifests as one who is none other than father. But we must also ponder upon the Holy Spirit. The Spirit in you, the Spirit in me is none other than God. That is why the scripture says, Luke 17:20-21 the kingdom of God is within you; Corinthians 3:16 God lives in the temple of your heart. If you put all these pieces together you will realize God is the father, God is the son, and is the Spirit that is in you and me. God is everywhere, in everything. Everything in this world that is beautiful is nothing but a manifestation of God.
I guess that makes sense, how are they connected?